I’m all for impeaching Trump – what happens if he’s replaced by Pence though? He’s arguably far worse in the long run (assuming we’re not plunged into nuclear war, etc. first).
Pence is not worse than Trump, and I will tell you why.
One, this is a choice of Chaotic Evil vs Lawful Evil. Lawful Evil we can deal with. Lawful Evil has its’ limits. Would Pence still be a shitty President with little to no consideration for the wellbeing of the people of this country? Yes he would. Is he likely to start a nuclear war? Fuuuuuck no.
Two, if we successfully impeach Trump, one of two things will happen. The first is that Pence becomes President and has to stare down a Congress that just completed the first successful impeachment of a sitting President in U.S. History. He will have to toe that fuckin’ line or else risk the same fate, however much it puckers his ass to do it. And Pence, despite his horrid policies, actually has political experience and understands how the government works. He knows you can’t just hand down executive orders and expect things to be carried, because he understands that the President is not the CEO of America. In short, he’s actually taken a goddamn Civics class.
The second is that, given the levels to which everything has already escalated, if/when Trump is impeached, it’s possible that members of his cabinet might be forced out with him. People are comparing what’s going on to Nixon’s Watergate scandal, but this is a bit of a misnomer. We are MILES beyond Watergate at this point. Nixon’s impeachment charges were obstruction of justice, abuse of power, and contempt of Congress. Trump has the first two, is well on his way to the third, and could collect a charge of high treason if the Russia investigation continues to go the way it’s been going thus far.
If Pence is found to be guilty of any of these same charges, he could be forced to resign as collateral damage, in which case Speaker of the House Paul Ryan would become President. Whatever happens, like I said before, the next person in that chair after Trump gets booted out of it will be under intense scrutiny from EVERYBODY. They won’t be able to put a hair out of line without getting utterly destroyed.
We need to stop thinking in perfections and absolutes as far as the presidency goes. That’s how Trump got elected in the first place. At this point, we are on damage control, and Trump needs to be ousted before he does something irreversible. After that’s dealt with, we’ll deal with what comes next. But we cannot drag our feet on calling for Trump’s impeachment simply because Pence is “almost as bad” or “might be worse in the long run.”
The long run isn’t going to matter if the country gets annihilated in the next four years or becomes the newest totalitarian fascist regime. We need to shut this down and we need to do it NOW.
Hello yes I have input.
I cannot, cannot by any means put articulate words into how much I, as a Hoosier, loathe Mike Pence.
I never wanted to be in a position where he might be president of my country, but here we are.
Listen.
It is what we call ‘turtles all the way down.’ Everyone in line is absolutely awful. I don’t want a damn one of them anywhere the Oval Office. But none of this can be helped.
Impeachment isn’t about getting the president you want. It’s about reminding the people in power that they serve YOU. That WE have power over them if we gather in numbers. And if they screw it up, WE are watching and it is on THEIR heads.
I can’t say that Pence will be worse or better. He’ll be worse in different ways and better in different ways. But I can tell you right now, knowing his history as a governor-
Oh man, does he hate bad PR. Like… he made his own damn newspaper so that he could avoid bad press after the RFRA laws. And that was when he just had Indiana watching his ass. He’d have the whole world watching him if he were president.
I have seen him cave to public pressure. It takes work, but it can be done.
So we take one down. We pass it around.
We have to be a constant thorn in the side of the entire administration, regardless of who is in charge of it. Because the fight doesn’t stop just because Boss Baby went down for a nappy nap.
The Archery Range 